[apvbguy]

be aware that I had an unwanted discharge from my Caracal C after it fell from waist height position onto a cement floor.
the gun impacted the on the rear of the gun and a round was discharged.
As far as I know this should never happen because of the safeties, somehow they didn't work as planned.

 

[Talyn]

Interesting.

Any more information you can provide?
Series number, batch? yada yada..

 

[apvbguy]

it really shouldn't matter what batch or serial number it is, this could be a potential defect, I wish they would return my call

 

[Talyn]

It could have been a problem with X batch or series of serial numbers that is known to a member here, or is listed somewhere here on the forum.

That way as well if others have same batch as you they can either try and discharge the weapon by hitting it with a 2x4 or something like that to see if they have the same issue.

But whatever. =)

I Hope this gets resolved.
That is a truly scary scary thought.

 

[jhb]

wow, that is scary. kinda surprising too, since these gun models passed the federal German armed forces testing house WTD91, the nato d14 test, and the German ta police standard / federal armed forces technical purchasing standard. i haven't read those standards, but i assumed they would check for safeties working on a standard 3ft drop on a hard surface? never assume anything i guess.

safe to assume you have done no tinkering or gunsmithing on your pistol? i only ask to get a better picture when i look over my own "f" model for a design weakness which should basically function the same. i'm a polite fellow and don't want my curiosity to come across as accusatory. i hope it doesn't read this way?


when you get caracal uae or usa or whichever country you are in to answer, could you update for the rest of us? thank you in advance Sir, and thanks for posting the warning. glad no one got shot by the discharge, or was hurt.

 

[apvbguy]

wow, that is scary. kinda surprising too, since these gun models passed the federal German armed forces testing house WTD91, the nato d14 test, and the German ta police standard / federal armed forces technical purchasing standard. i haven't read those standards, but i assumed they would check for safeties working on a standard 3ft drop on a hard surface? never assume anything i guess.

safe to assume you have done no tinkering or gunsmithing on your pistol? i only ask to get a better picture when i look over my own "f" model for a design weakness which should basically function the same. i'm a polite fellow and don't want my curiosity to come across as accusatory. i hope it doesn't read this way?


when you get caracal uae or usa or whichever country you are in to answer, could you update for the rest of us? thank you in advance Sir, and thanks for posting the warning. glad no one got shot by the discharge, or was hurt.

actually I was grazed, broke the skin fortunately that was it. the gun was bought in Jan of 2012, before this last batch of "new" ones arrived. it has the waffen works on it but they were gone already. AFAIK the gun was NIB when I received it and I have done NOTHING to it.
it was scary especially since I was led to believe that in a striker fired weapon a malfunction like this was impossible. FWIW the gun did not eject the spent round.

 

[Deluxe247]

Glad you are OK. Please keep us informed of the situation. If you get nowhere I can give you some contacts that will help.

-D

 

[apvbguy]

Glad you are OK. Please keep us informed of the situation. If you get nowhere I can give you some contacts that will help.

-D

thanks for your offer, PM with the contacts. I put a call into jeff at steyr, the last I heard he was handling Caracal as well. I would like to send the gun in so it can be looked at. I and I am sure others would want to know exactly what failed and caused the gun to fire.

 

[Talyn]

thanks for your offer, PM with the contacts. I put a call into jeff at steyr, the last I heard he was handling Caracal as well. I would like to send the gun in so it can be looked at. I and I am sure others would want to know exactly what failed and caused the gun to fire.

Glad that you are okay.

 

[jhb]

actually I was grazed, broke the skin fortunately that was it. the gun was bought in Jan of 2012, before this last batch of "new" ones arrived. it has the waffen works on it but they were gone already. AFAIK the gun was NIB when I received it and I have done NOTHING to it.
it was scary especially since I was led to believe that in a striker fired weapon a malfunction like this was impossible. FWIW the gun did not eject the spent round.

I said wow before, but now with those details.....I'm saying WOW. Very scary...glad you got came through okay. That would have shaken me to my core as I'm sure it did to you.

Good info, thank you Sir for the followup and details.

Think I'm gonna retire mine from carry until the details come from Jeff. Id rather be accused of over reacting and stay safe. Thanks again for the warning.....greatly appreciated.

 

[apvbguy]

I said wow before, but now with those details.....I'm saying WOW. Very scary...glad you got came through okay. That would have shaken me to my core as I'm sure it did to you.

Good info, thank you Sir for the followup and details.

Think I'm gonna retire mine from carry until the details come from Jeff. Id rather be accused of over reacting and stay safe. Thanks again for the warning.....greatly appreciated.

until this is sorted out, unloading and storing your caracal weapons would be a prudent thing to do.

 

[Syntax360]

A sample of (1) isn't exactly just cause to lose our minds unload all the Caracals of the world. I'm reserving judgment until we get some more official data about the state of the weapon and an idea of what went wrong - as other posters have mentioned, the Caracal design has been subject to some pretty extreme testing by some very professional and experienced organizations.

Please keep us posted!

 

[apvbguy]

A sample of (1) isn't exactly just cause to lose our minds unload all the Caracals of the world. I'm reserving judgment until we get some more official data about the state of the weapon and an idea of what went wrong - as other posters have mentioned, the Caracal design has been subject to some pretty extreme testing by some very professional and experienced organizations.

Please keep us posted!

the state of the weapon is that less than 300 rounds have been through it, it has been field stripped and cleaned a couple of times. there has been absolutely no modifications made to the weapon. the weapon fell to the ground (cement floor) hit on the right rear corner of the slide and it expended a round and it failed to eject that round. the gun was in a holster that cover the trigger and there was no attempt made to catch the falling gun.
my concern is that with the safeties in place this should not have happened, I did a little research and found that similar incidents have occurred with Glocks, so their safety systems may be suspect as well.
It is not my intent to make Caracal, Glock or any other gun maker or safety systen look bad, my intent is to learn as much as possible as to how this happened and to warn people about a potential issue. Guns are too dangerous of an object to play games with, if something is not working properly it is prudent to stop using it and get answers as to why it isn't working properly.

 

[Syntax360]

I agree whole-heartedly. What I meant is, I'm interested to find out if any of the internal safeties somehow broke or suffered some bizarre premature wear. I really would like to see Jeff check this one out.

 

[apvbguy]

I agree whole-heartedly. What I meant is, I'm interested to find out if any of the internal safeties somehow broke or suffered some bizarre premature wear. I really would like to see Jeff check this one out.

fwiw: it has been a week since they've had the gun, I reached out today for some info and Herbert (the gun tech I believe) seems to have moved the case onto Jeff who has not been available this afternoon, I wonder how much test was done or if any at all was done. I would like to have my gun back, in good working order of course!

 

[apvbguy]

final update, SAI is sending the weapon to Caracal in the UAE for the manufacturer to exam. more than likely we'll probably never know exactly what happened, which is a shame, I am sure if there is something to this they would take an appropriate measure.
Apparently there is not a firing pin block safety so that didn't fail, however there was no trigger pull so the trigger safeties is more than likely the source of the failure. I am getting a replacement gun unfortunately my early model is gone. c'est la vie.

 

[jhb]

Glad you are getting a new gun. Guess well never get to know what failed. Hopefully its a one off and not the design that failed. Thank you for the update.

 

[apvbguy]

Glad you are getting a new gun. Guess well never get to know what failed. Hopefully its a one off and not the design that failed. Thank you for the update.

while it good that I am getting a new gun I can't help but think that they ( SAI/CARACAL ) is just trying to bury this.
like you I'd like to know exactly what happened and why it happened. is this a one of issue or is it a design flaw? Caracal shouldn't be blowing me off like this

 

[ETH77]

Don't assume that you're being blown off. I suspect that Caracal wants to test the weapon under known conditions, and it wouldn't surprise me if they called in Hr. Bubits to be a party to the discussions. If the weapons have passed the German Military qualification tests, then having a production weapon fail is a serious problem. It may have to do with faulty parts, assembly, ... The same thing would happen with any weapon not completely manufactured in the US.

I would also be concerned if it had happened to me and I got a replacement but didn't know if it was a one-off accident. You could always try to duplicate the conditions, but with a primer only in the case in the chamber, no powder. That does run the risk of dinging the weapon up though.

 

[Syntax360]

That is unfortunate. Please, keep after them for an answer about the broken gun.