They forgot the selector switch... (long range report)

Discussion in 'M, C, L and S Series' started by FlaChef, Sep 5, 2006.

  1. FlaChef

    FlaChef Guest

    I sold my M40 at a show last weekend ($400 w/ 6 mags), and Thursday I picked up my new M9A1 ($458 out the door). Basicly I was shooting about 5 times as much 9mm in my S9 due to the cost, and using the 40 only for outdoor IDPA matches for the longer sight radius (indoor idpa it doesn't matter as almost no stages are over 10 yards). So the m9 would be better suited to the role and the only way I could afford a new gun is to sell one.

    Did a quick field cleaning job and headed to the range on Friday w/ four marked magazines (the two that came w/ it and the two M9 mags I use as my extra S9 mags) and whatever 9mm I had at the house.

    First up 47 rnds of wwb 115gr FMJ..... NO Issues, really liking the gun

    Second up 50rnds of CCI Blazer (aluminum) 115gr FMJ....... 1 FTE, round stuck in the chamber pretty good. The case was not bulged and all spent al and brass looked good. But hey, it's aluminum and 1 out of 97 ain't bad for break-in period. Still liking it, and not concerned.

    Third up 100rnds of the same WWB 115gr FMJ ...... NO FTE"S, but this is where the fun starts....
    By now I've moved on to doing some Hammer Drills*. Could've been my imigination, but it sounded like it might have doubled (Remember I'm pulling the trigger FAST) but all rounds on paper (-1 zone on IDPA target).
    Then for the last three mags it's rapid (but sighted and controlled, so not blazing fast) shooting at about 8 yards. DEINITELY NO MISTAKING THE FULL-AUTO EFFECT NOW. Don't know if it was 5 or 6 rounds, but it was one of those numbers as it happened mid mag and did not empty the mag. Not the same mag as when it doubled earlier. There was a hole on the top right portion of the target about 3/4 an inch in diameter so most were at the backstop, but I definetly saw sparks of, I think, 1 round bouncing off the ceiling baffle plates. THANK GOD I was indoors w/ deflector plates to keep errant rounds in or it would've been over the berm and into the wild blue yonder.
    The final few went bang no problem (in SLOW fire w/ a death grip on the gun to see if it would happen again).

    I WOULD LOVE A M VERSION OF A G18, BUT GUNS THAT ARE NOT DESIGNED TO GO FULL AUTO SHOULD NOT DO SO!!!!!!


    Now do I try to go shoot it again as is and see if the issue repeats itself (the shop dude's recomendation)?

    Or should I clean the ever loving bejesus out of it in all it's individual little dissasembled pieces and hope it doesn't happen again? I did strip the FP on the spot and saw no signs of brass flakes in the channel. If I do this it would be at least a 1000 problem free rounds before I would trust it at an outdoor match (this gun will be primarily for IDPA use as I have the S and my little j frame for carry).

    Or just back to the factory right now (if i don't do this immediately I WILL if it happens a second time after cleaning and inspection)?

    For now I have a $458 pistol case filler holding the case down in the closet as far as I'm concerned. This is the first time I've had a gun I don't trust; it is not a warm fuzzy feeling.




    * Hammer Drill is six shots as rapidly as you can pull the trigger point shooting (for me I do it at about 6 yards). Basiccly it's an exercise to see how well you're handling recoil by seeing you'r group size. Thanks to IDPA Steyr for teaching me this one.
     
  2. madecov

    madecov Active Member

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    Since you know how to tear it down, I would tear it down and clean it well. Then re assemble.

    Then shoot the heck out of it.
    If the problem persists then call SAI and send her out for repair.
     

  3. Gray_Wolf

    Gray_Wolf New Member

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    I'd say give it a 'normal' cleaning and try it again, but I wouldn't load more than 5 rounds in a magazine.
     
  4. nixon

    nixon Member

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    I've done it before with a Para ord P16 (series 90 with firing pin block) when it was brand new and unaltered state. I was trying to stage the trigger and see if could lessen the time to pull the trigger in double taps. Lucklily, I had only three left in the mags when the auto firing happened and all shots went into the target at 25 yds. while sitting on a bench and had some sand bags for gun rest as I was testing for the P16's accuracy potential.

    Will give it a normal cleaning and try it again but be very safe.
     
  5. bigtaco

    bigtaco Active Member

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    i had mine going full auto, and i would do it on purpose if i wasn't worried about the lengthy prison term WHEN i got caught.

    i'll bet you any quarter ever minted by the treasury that there is a groove in the face of your post. this groove is caused by a burr on the sear. the groove catches the sear and doesn't let the sear up to engage the firing pin tang. as such the firing pin is free to go flying willy-nilly into the primer. bang. cycle starts all over again. it only stops when the sear gets free of the post or you run out of ammo.

    usually, the second bang is enough of a jolt to loosen the sear from the post and you get two bangs. if you've got full auto, meaning mag emptying, that groove is deep.

    if you feel good tearing it down, this whole thing is explained in the trigger tutorial. but... you have a brand new gun.

    i say keep trying it. if it keeps screwing up, send it back. no reason for you to get dirty fixing something under warrenty.
     
  6. FlaChef

    FlaChef Guest

    spent about an hour yesterday tearing it totally down, inspecting and scrubbing the bejesus out of it.

    went to one of my neighborhood indoor ranges w/ 350 rounds of 115gr FMJ (mixed WWB, Rem UMC, Blazer Brass).

    fired the first shot dead on accurate, then the second trigger pull sent 3 rounds downrange.

    back to SAI...

    For the record the gun is in the 39XXX serial range and came from RSR wholesale in FL (who said they only had nine left, but since it is one of the older A1's that still says just M9 on the slide I'm guessing they don't rotate their stock religiously)

    kinda a hassle for a new gun. Shipping expense, trying to be home when UPS/Fedex comes; etc...

    one problem child steyr out of the three :?
    If the things didn't shoot better than anything else I've tried I might be discouraged :lol:
     
  7. DAIadvisor

    DAIadvisor New Member

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    Full auto Steyr, eh?? You know, if you put a compensator on it, and lighten the slide (glock 18 style) it might actually be pretty cool. Selector swith could go in the old safety place. Plus, get an extended 18 round (Jet Funnel style), and you're in business. :) :)
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Strictly on a coolness scale, a full auto Steyr pegs the meter. Having said that, I would think that our friends at Steyr would want that malfunctioning pistol back ASAP. If for no other reason, for liability purposes. I can see the scenario now. Steyr gunner at the range having fun shooting his Steyr. Suddenly it goes full auto. Nothing but bad can come from this. Unexpected loss of control, being reported to BATF (bad juju), banned from the range et al. My suggestion is send it back to Steyr for repair. At a minimum call Steyr and explain your situation. Just my two cents...


    Kammerjaeger
     
  9. Wulf

    Wulf Premium Member

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    Full Auto Steyr

    Hiya *Chef :)

    I've had it happen. Got worse so I sent it back to SAI. Al Cornett fixed it and sent it back. No problems since. Send it back!

    Wulf
     
  10. uncle_walty

    uncle_walty Member

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    I'm surprised to hear that this is a relatively common problem with the Steyr. FlaChef and wulf, was your problem caused by the grove in the post like BT's? Assume you guys had relatively good triggers OTB and didn't have to polish your FCG parts. I had to polish so i'm sure i don't have a burr on my sear to cause a grove. Or is there some peening going on with the sear and post from the recoil causing the grove and we'll all get full auto Steyrs eventually.
     
  11. Wulf

    Wulf Premium Member

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    Hiya Uncle_Waltey :)

    I asked Al what he did to fix it and he emailed back.

    I don't think its a recurring problem.<shrug> *Chef and I are the only ones that I know of.

    Wulf
     
  12. FlaChef

    FlaChef Guest

    Package delivered to SAI in Cumming GA on 9/20.
    Package shipped from SAI on 9/25

    Invoice states parts replaced....
    Firing Pin Spring 3900040008
    Firing Pin Spring Guide 3900040018
    Firing Pin 3900040001
    Catch 3900020001
    Lever 3900020018

    Also states, test fired and cleaned.

    I have NO IDEA what "catch' and "lever" are :?

    Took it out to the same corner range on 9/28

    put 299 rounds of 115gr FMJ (149 Rem UMC, 100 Blazer Brass, 50 WWB) through it w/ one FTE on the Rem UMC stuff. (that brings total down the pipe to 500 even plus what they test fired in GA w/ only two FTE's.

    No other problems, other than a user error of pinching my pinky between mag and grip doing speed reloads hard enough to draw blood (that Hurt).

    I'm thinking of not cleaning it other than a quick bore snake at the end of a shooting session while still warm to see how long it will go on whatever lube they used on it.
     
  13. bigtaco

    bigtaco Active Member

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    catch is steyrese for sear.

    lever is almost assuredly the trigger bar.
     
  14. scoutdawg55

    scoutdawg55 Guest

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    catcth and lever

    The catch and lever are two parts within the trigger assy. they actually but up to each other. They are both replaced when the multi function part is rebuilt, along with the springs.