interesting article on the 'center mass myth'

Discussion in 'Anything Else' started by majette, Feb 18, 2010.

  1. ETH77

    ETH77 Premium Member

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    Jibes well with what I've been told by Viet Vets. Watching the Sniper show on History International last Sunday reinforces it. They shoot for base of brain - easier to do with a rifle - for instant "rag doll".

    I've started practicing hostage situations, just to get the close aiming right. I'm buying a timer, just to put the pressure on, and there will be forced movement down the road. I wish there were more ranges where such things could be practiced on a twice a week basis. I may be forced to get an airsoft to get it right.
     

  2. socofn

    socofn New Member

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    What an amazing insightful article. I have cared for more than one person who was been shot multiple times in vital organs (heart and lungs) and lived to stay in the fight (one dude even used a golf club on his attacker after being hit in the pulmonary artery).

    so I guess what we learned from this article was, we need to be carrying a bazooka and be able to hit what we shoot at.

    Take care and remember “anyone worth shooting once is worth shooting a whole lot!”

    JP
     
  3. manChild_762

    manChild_762 New Member

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    Well I seem to recall that there was a shooting standard set by one of the early Seal Teams, 6 I think it was when Richard Marcinko was in charge, that it had to be in a 3x5 index card. Didn't care how you were standing, shooting between your legs, but the rounds need to hit the card.

    I must admit, that was going off some very very old memory of some of his material. Who knows might make myself sound like an idiot for saying it.. Oh well. I am now the Villiage Idiot.. :joker:
     
  4. rokhppr

    rokhppr New Member

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    Thanks for posting that...some good useful info for sure.
     
  5. Soverign

    Soverign Premium Member

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    What was the brit's SAS tactic with the BHP. Double to the chest and one to the head!
     
  6. Narsil

    Narsil Premium Member

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    I've never shot at anyone but always presumed it was to keep firing until I was out of ammo or the attacker(s) stopped twitching.

    We really need the shrugging emoticon.
     
  7. ThaiBoxer

    ThaiBoxer Active Member

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    I read that too in Rogue Warrior, and used it a lot, stapling them to leftover IDPA/IPSC targets. A 3"x5" card on the chest, and folded for a head shot, 2.5" x 3."

    If it doesn't hit the card...it doesn't count.
     
  8. CZ4Me

    CZ4Me New Member

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    Aim small, miss small. I got my first BB gun when I was 7 or 8 years old. I drew some targets, was all proud of myself...my dad said "Pretty good shooting...but here, shoot these" and stuck 5 or 6 nickels in the dirt. That's all I shot with my little Daisy BB gun for months. Then my dad bought me a pellet gun and we went squirrel hunting. I always aimed for the eye, if I missed the eye, I still usually hit the head...aim small, miss small. Did the same thing with bottle caps with my first handgun, a .22 revolver at age 12. If you practice hitting a bottle cap, and aim for the tip of someone's nose and miss, hopefully you won't miss by more than an inch or two :)
     
  9. Talyn

    Talyn New Member

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  10. Talyn

    Talyn New Member

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  11. DVD84

    DVD84 New Member

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    Good article. The fatal T is the preferred spot to aim for but is a much smaller area to hit. Law enforcement and the military are trained to shoot center mass as it gives the highest probable percentage for a kill or "stopping shot" since lawyers pick everything to bits. Law enforcement shoots to stop not kill. Certain units are trained a little bit different in that regard. As the article points out the Fatal T extends down to the top of the sternum, and is a tight shot, hence the reason combat marksmanship teaches controlled pairs, your chances of hitting the spinal cord are doubled.

    The index cards have been used forever, Marcinko just likes to run his mouth, none the less it's a good idea. They are a great way to slow people down. Once you are used to shooting scenarios like this you can paste them on the back of the target to really push yourself. You can also post these cards and pasties to make it more difficult along the major arteries. May not be an instant kill but it's a good way to stop someone and gain a few seconds. As a man much wiser than me has stated, speed is good, accuracy is final.
     
  12. Talyn

    Talyn New Member

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    I understand shooting FMJ at center mass wont work.

    Even with a 45acp it could not work.

    One of these new engineered hollow points at center mass, i'm not double tapping even with a 9mm. Your going down.

    +p 9mm going 14 inches in ballistics gell? That guy is cooked.

    2 inch cavities? Your down for the count.

    Transfer that to a 45, the shock of the bullet will drop you when it impacts and mushrooms.

    Now, I'm not saying these would be instant kill shots.
    Nor do any of these rules apply if somebody is drugged up or drunk.
     
  13. ETH77

    ETH77 Premium Member

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    The whole point of the text is that it doesn't always work - period, even with a hollowpoint. If it did, there wouldn't be all these examples of where it didn't work. Combat effective shooting is making the bad guy stop, if it doesn't, it isn't effective.

    The idea is, make sure you've done what you wanted to do, stop the agressor or threat. If it takes a Mozambique, be ready to do that. About 80% of people shot with pistols survive. 20% of people shot with rifles survive. Snipers are effective because they use headshots in most cases, they also use rifles. If you don't have a rifle, two to the CM followed, if necessary, by a headshot will normally finish things. Pause before the headshot - for two reasons, one you need to know if your CM shots worked, two, you need to take the time to really aim the third shot - a HS is difficult to make "Shoot between the eyes and lips, no not between the hips..." lyrics courtesy of www.frfrogspad.com.
     
  14. Talyn

    Talyn New Member

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    Great post bud.

    And I have to say you are right and I was being cocky with my post.