A greeting and a question

Discussion in 'M, C, L and S Series' started by Saevar, Apr 27, 2006.

  1. Saevar

    Saevar New Member

    2
    0
    0
    First, hi everyone! I've been lurking a few days. I'm fairly shy, so I tend not to post. But I'm kind of bursting with questions, so here I am. :)

    I live in North Carolina (and have noticed a number of you do as well). I'll be upfront about my firearms experience. Which is to say its limited.

    I've handled a Colt revolver about 10 years ago. Also pump and semi-auto 12 gauges around the same time. A couple of years ago I had the pleasure of handling a 9mm, .357 magnum, .38 special, and a 20 gauge. Thats pretty much the whole in-person exposure I've had to firearms.

    So, recently I've had the urge to drop by a range. I started looking around for information about ranges and weapons. Which brings me to my question. Well.. questions, I suppose.

    Any recommendations from you NC folks in/around Raleigh about the ranges?

    I've spent a couple of weeks nosing around the 'net. But I think I've gotten about as far with websites as I think I can get for the moment. I've got a few makes in mind. Steyr and Walther are topping my list. Sig and CZ are a tucked in behind. And while I'd consider a Glock, I'm not really enthusiastic of the idea. I can find lots of mentions of how Glocks are dependable but very few of great Glock ergonomics. So, I've been looking around but I keep coming back to the Steyr M and MA1s. My only concern here is the couple of threads speculating that the 9mm models have a higher malfunction rate. Which is making me look at a Walther P99 pretty hard.

    Sigs I can find a lot of information about, CZs not quite so much. However, Sigs just haven't struck the same chord with me that MA1s and P99s have despite the Sig reputation for quality, which is why they're not topping my list. And the dearth of information on CZs (maybe I'm just not really looking in the right places..) is why they're sitting in a secondary position.

    So.. for you Carolinians, do any of these ranges have P99s or M/MA1s around to rent? I'd like to know how they sit in my hands. If both feel good, then I guess I'll need to address my concerns about M9-A1s (because.. even before I found this forum, thats pretty much what I was looking for).

    And.. lastly.. some questions for everybody. I'm looking at 9mm mostly because of the cost of ammo. However, I don't know, for sure, what the costs per 100 rounds non-bulk for 9mm, .40 S&W, and .357 Sig. Any info about prices either by box or in bulk appreciated. Although I'm not sure I could swing a bulk ammo purchase..

    Some day down the road I might like to enter a USPSA or IDPA event. Does 9mm make a larger showing at IDPA events than USPSA because of IPSC's power factor bonus?

    Any flaws with any of my notions?

    Any makes/models you think I should take a look at for a first weapon?

    Sorry for a bit of a long post!

    Oh.. I wasn't absolutely sure where I should post this, so feel free to move the thread and poke fun at me!
     
  2. Shooter

    Shooter Premium Member

    1,681
    3
    38
    Wow......lots of questions.....all those guns you mentioned are good.......I think IDPA will take any caliber..........You really should try and shoot the guns you are thinking of to see which one suits you.......... 9mm ammo is definately cheaper, less recoil...P99 seems to get a lots of positive responses and although I'm not a Sig guy, my brother is....I personally don't like them......It's gotta be your choice.....I'm sure you are going to get a few more really detailed responses on your questions..........
    Good luck....... :D
     

  3. neviv

    neviv New Member

    41
    0
    0
    9mm? try Glock17 and Steyr M9
     
  4. Deluxe247

    Deluxe247 Supporting Member

    2,497
    2
    0
  5. mikey

    mikey New Member

    92
    0
    0
    Welcome, Saevar! And it’s good to be hesitant about that gun purchase, for unless you’re rolling in dough, a new handgun is a major investment (it’s a big bummer indeed when you lay out five or six bills for a new autoloader, only to find that it doesn’t really suit you).

    Absolutely, then, try to scour your area for a shooting range where they have handguns for rent. Test fire a few, take some mental notes, and then go back a week later and shoot them again. For a relatively small investment in time and money, you’ll get a much better idea of what you really want and need.

    Hardly anybody likes the Glock’s ergonomics. Doesn’t seem to faze the Glock fans, who rave about their reliability. They have a point, but reliability alone isn’t enough to satisfy me (were that the case, I’d junk my other rifles, buy a couple of AK-47’s, and be a happy camper).

    As for problems with Steyr’s 9mm’s, well, I hear that the 9 is somewhat more trouble prone than the 40 (not sure if that’s really true, or if it’s just slanted reporting). But remember that any arms maker can turn out a turkey now and then. I bought a SIG P220 years ago, in .45 ACP, and the dammed thing wouldn’t feed anything but hardball. I complained to SIG’s American distributor, and they never responded. Got really ticked off and then finally sold it at a big loss.

    Learned later (in a column by Massad Ayoob) that SIG had turned out a flakey batch of P220’s, but that the problem had (allegedly) been fixed. Maybe so, but I was still turned off SIG’s and I don’t plan to buy another.

    Probably unfair of me, but it goes to show that nothing’s perfect. So, if you really end up loving the feel and performance of the Steyr 9mm, I wouldn’t let a handful of horror stories turn you off. There’s a lot of fine performing Steyr 9mm’s out there.
     
  6. ministerofdeath

    ministerofdeath New Member

    925
    0
    0
    Well, I can't speak intelligently about the CZ as I've only ever fired one once in my life. However, I can speak about the Steyr M-series, MA1, and Walther P99.

    The Walther P99 is an outstanding pistol in many respects. The Ergonomics are superior to most mass-production pistols available on the market. However, it does not have the low bore axis that the Steyr M and MA1 series have and I think that the Steyr has a slight advantage in that as a result it has less felt recoil (IMO), but there isn't a huge difference really. The Walther P99 is a joy to shoot, but it isn't the most safe pistol to carry with a chambered round.

    The only safety in the Walther P99 is the heavy trigger pull available in the Double Action Only version and to a lesser degree in the Anti-Stress Action (I wouldn't carry the Quick Action concealed). Now if you're like me and you carry a pistol every day the whole year round you want safety. Even the Law Enforcement Officers with training and years experience will have neglegent discharges (it can happen to anyone). So, anything that makes a pistol safer is a good thing in my book.

    The Steyr is unmatched when it comes to ergonomics....UNMATCHED....did I say that it has no equal? :D If you aren't comfortable firing the Steyr than you should get out of the pistol shooting world. The thing is smooth and accurate with a crazy ability to have tight groupings with fast follow-up shots. The Steyr is a very safe weapon to carry with a round chambered. I think that any pistol should be safe to carry with a round in the chamber, because the last thing I want to do if I must use it is take the time to rack the slide and chamber a round. The Springfield XD is probably the only pistol out there that is in the same catergory when it comes to safety as the Steyr (IMO). The M-series has a total of FIVE Safeties! The MA1 has all those safeties with the exception that it does not come standard with the manual safety the M-series has. Internal locks are also standard with the M and MA1 so you can lock the weapon if you've got young ones around without searching for a pistol trigger lock. Not to mention the Steyr has a nice Load Chamber Indicator (LCI). Now, some folks don't care for the LCI because it does leave dents in your brass casings of spent ammunition, but I like anything that makes my weapon safer without hindering its operation. Great pistol...I could go on and on about it.
     
  7. Thunderbear

    Thunderbear Member

    341
    0
    16
    Where in NC? I know no ranges that have either the older M9/40 or the MA1s. I ordered mine from PDHSC, and got a good deal and it was the only way to get my hands on a Steyr. Few teething problems, but I love it.
     
  8. FlaChef

    FlaChef Guest

    Don't know squat about NC, but I'm sure some of the NC Steyroids can maybe help you out and meet you at a range somewhere...

    Any of those guns will work fine for what you want, as long as you are in that top tier of makers you can't go wrong, it's just preferance.

    They all have their ups and downs.

    go to you nearest wal-mart or mega sporting goods type store (whichever chain is in your area) and look at ammo prices.

    for here it is $12 and $16 for 9mm and .40 100 round value packs of Winchester White Box (WWB)
     
  9. Saevar

    Saevar New Member

    2
    0
    0
    Oops. I've been slacking here. Thanks for the welcomes and the responses!

    Thunderbear: I live right on the line that seperates Apex and Cary. Most of my friends live out in Garner, though, so PDHSC is pretty much on my way out there.

    FlaChef: Did that last night ;) I didn't see any .40 S&W or .357 Sig at the sporting goods store, but the 9mm boxes and the prices on all 3 calibres at Wal-mart match your numbers.

    I think ministerofdeath might be subtly suggesting the Steyr. Just a little. :) Which isn't really necessary. Every time a I see a picture of a Steyr I want to reach through my monitor, grab (what should be!) my pistol and run to a range.

    mikey: I'm definitely not rolling in dough. Although I'm really, really, really considering an M9-A1 without ever handling it. I may go try whichever makes PDHSC has and if I don't find something that really, really, really captures my attention, then start looking for a M9-A1. Maybe I'll check it out tomorrow, even..

    Delux247: Oooh. Thanks for the CZ links! Not sure how I missed those..
     
  10. madecov

    madecov Active Member

    1,190
    3
    38
    I own 40 cal Steyr and walther pistols.

    The Walther grip may have a slight edge over the Steyr but the Steyr has a lower bore axis and therefore less muzzle flip.

    My Walther is the AS trigger (traditional double action with a deckocker).

    I like the feel and looks of the Steyr, it fits me like a glove and points like a natural extension of my hand.

    Both weapons are very very accurate, with a slight edge going to the Walther, but that edge is very very small.

    Steyr now has a presence here in the US so service and parts should not be an issue. Walther is backd by Smith & Wesson with about the best service you could have.

    Steyr pistols will cost about $200.00 less than a walther P99 and magazines are $10-20.00 less.

    I don't think Walther makes a factory 357 but 357 is very epensive

    Either are fine weapons.